How C-Suite Collaboration Shapes the Success of CTOs and their Companies with Etienne de Bruin, Founder of 7CTOs

(Intro Narrator at 00:00:00) Today, we're talking to Etienne de Bruin about his latest book on CTO excellence and how to balance the entrepreneurial spirit. You're listening to Joel Beasley, Modern CTO.

(Joel Beasley at 00:00:16) Dude, this is great. Alright, so you have a new book. Let's talk about your book. What is this book that you've written?

(Etienne de Bruin at 00:00:22) So the reason, first and foremost, I wanted to write a book—because I want to write several books. Right before COVID, as you know, I founded 7CTOs. I talked to hundreds of CTOs like you do. We do a lot of coaching and peer coaching in groups with CTOs. So I see a lot going on with the same people all the time. Like, we have cohorts. And one of the things I noticed that was making me sad was watching CTOs come into new positions at companies or watching CTOs who sort of let their roles go stale. And sometimes it's circumstantial, but it was sad for me to see brilliant minds, people who can solve incredible problems, brilliant thinkers really screw the pooch when it comes to some really basic things to work inside of a company. And so I was thinking, what if I could give people, especially CTOs, a period of time, and during that period, a way to set themselves up to succeed at a company? So I came up with a hundred days because in America, presidents keep saying, "In my first hundred days, I'll do A, B, and C." They make a lot of promises for their first hundred days.

(Joel Beasley at 00:02:00) Well, in America, that's actually the only time they do any work. That's—well, I lied. I lied. There's another hundred days before reelection.

(Etienne de Bruin at 00:02:12) Right before the reelection. Yes. That's hilarious. I actually did draw the inspiration from politicians because when I was coming to America in the 2000s, I was interviewing in California, and the presidential race was on between Bush and Al Gore. And I just, in these debates and in these conversations, I just heard them say, "Well, in my first hundred days, I am going to tackle this, and I'm going to establish that." And on day one, "I'm going to this." And then I did some research about the first hundred days, and it actually comes from FDR's days in the Great Depression, where he basically created the New Deal with America. And he did actually do most of his work in his first hundred days. And so my thinking was, what if I could give the CTO a hundred-day guide for what to focus on so that they can have a really frictionless landing into a company, which, of course, involves just so much more than the tech? It's the relationships, it's communication, it's EQ, it's, of course, the business objectives. It's understanding what success looks like to other C-suite members. And so the book really takes you through what a hundred days could look like for you, what you should do in those hundred days in order to set yourself up for success at the company, if it's a new one you've joined. Or, like I said, if you are in a bit of a lull, this is like a hundred days for you to revamp your role at the company.

(Joel Beasley at 00:04:07) I love it. And I'm so grateful that you did something like this because, you know, you will get people that listen to the show, and they study the speakers or myself who has done that. And I'll know the 20, the 30 things, the things that you should be thinking about. And but here's the thing at the end. If I actually got hired as the CTO of a company tomorrow, I still need to write it out because it's not a plan until it's written out. And you can know all the things, but to bring them up in real time in the correct order and then to make sure that this blueprint has some legitimacy behind it—for example, you and your team coaching people through this exact thing. I mean, Mitesh, right? He's in his first hundred days right now. Did he get a copy of this book?

(Etienne de Bruin at 00:04:59) Did he? Mitesh. Yeah. Mitesh, if you're listening, go buy the book, bro. So what the book does is it introduces the concept of a CTO journal. So each chapter has a journaling component to it so that you can, like you said, sit down and actually write out what you're experiencing at the company. Like, who are the key people that are maybe loud voices in the leadership team? What are previous disappointments that may have kneecapped your predecessor? What are some quick wins that can communicate innovation and change without signing you up for a velocity that is impossible to maintain? So just to be, you know, on a weekly basis through the journaling, through the book, to just be intentional about, "Oh, you know what? I should do this flowchart," or "This business process needs a little improvement." And through those hundred days to set you up to be—all the way from business objectives, all the way through leadership and socializing a little bit, all the way through to your own technology strategy and plan and understanding where you want to go, all the way through to understanding what the stakeholders want for the success of the company. These, to me, are all things that when, like you said, when I hit the ground running as a newly appointed CTO, there's a lot of focus on the dev team, the culture, the blockers, the velocity, the delivery, you know, uptime, thousands of one-on-one meetings, you know. So you can get caught up in the weeds pretty quickly. And this book is sort of your companion to help remind you, "Hey, you're on a hundred-day journey, and you're either working for or against your future self right now." And so I want you to work for your future self in this new role, and that's what this book does.

(Joel Beasley at 00:07:18) So was all of the content in the book from personal experience, from 7CTOs team members? Where did you get all the content from?

(Etienne de Bruin at 00:07:29) It was a lot of it was personal, and a lot of it was in my coaching of CTOs. I would say a lot of the structure came from my personal experience. The anecdotes and stories in there are drawn from my experiences. There are—I think, like I said, the impetus for really getting into the book was just my own disappointment when I was able to connect an amazing CTO with an amazing company, and then a couple months later to find out that they couldn't make it work. And then when I find out why they couldn't make it work, I was even more distraught because I realized, "Oh my goodness. This is some basic things that wasn't done by the new CTO to help massage their way into that company's culture, that company's all the baggage that comes with that company since its inception." Oftentimes, the problems that you're being hired to solve are not the problems that you're going to be solving if you do it right. Like, you can come in and you can refactor the system. You can help add a new pricing plan or introduce a free tier to your SaaS business or go multinational or launch in various continents. You can do all of that. But ultimately, how your fellow C-suite members view success is really what makes themselves successful. CRO wants to hit the numbers. The CMO wants to do attribution. The CFO wants to reduce cost. You know, the CEO wants to expand the brand and team culture. A lot of these things have got nothing to do with your technology department, but when you need allies and when you need togetherness and collaboration and when you're cashing in some equity because you need to take the team to an off-site or you need to address a very difficult part of the system that is broken down and you rely on people to trust you to roll with it, well, if you haven't been doing any relational work, empathy work, if you didn't go to that happy hour and drink just one drink with someone to listen to their story, well, then when you need it most, it's going to be missing. And then, in most cases, the guns will be turned around and facing you. And it'll be, "Well, the CTO came in, and they were great, but they kind of suck right now." And, you know, and then those allies are gone. And that's what I want—I really want to help great people, really want them to overcome those first hundred days so that they can be set up to succeed together.

(Joel Beasley at 00:10:33) I love it.

(Etienne de Bruin at 00:10:34) Wow. I sound really passionate about this.

(Joel Beasley at 00:10:37) You're very passionate about it, and rightfully so. I mean, you're great. If for those who don't know, Etienne is the equivalent of Tony Robbins for CTOs. He's like the guy. He's expensive, of course, because he's worth it. But he's the guy. And honestly, Etienne, your greatness is the reason I'm friends with you. I want to have great friends. I want to be around people who master their craft and who are amazing. And, you know, when I first met you, you were kind enough to see past my childishness and my domination aspect. And then as we got to know each other a little bit more, I mean, you've been a very positive influence in my life professionally. I remember one time when we were at—I think we were in North Carolina, I had handled a situation fairly poorly on email. And I mentioned it to you, and you just looked at me, and you were like, "And you thought that was a good idea?" And I was like, "You know what? It wasn't a good idea. It wasn't." And then I tried to defend it, and I was like, it didn't work very well. But you're intelligent, you're experienced, but you're kind enough to let me get it out, right? You're kind enough to say, "Okay. He's just at that stage right now." And that's awesome because those moments where you don't do much and, you know, don't beat me up for it and don't sit there and lecture me for it. Just the way that you responded, you have so much credibility with me. I thought about that moment for like months after, and I've been so much better about handling that type of situation. And that's every time that situation comes up, I think about you.

(Etienne de Bruin at 00:12:18) Wow. It makes me happy. And I really appreciate that. And, you know, I will say, I'm someone who can get very down on myself, be very skeptical. I can be glass half empty. I could find all the reasons something shouldn't work, wouldn't work. And that's where you've impacted me greatly, brother. Your energy, your ability to see the good, to imagine what is possible. You're probably one of the handful of people in my life that can speak to me so directly. Because when I was your age, I was skeptical and negative and young, and I was glass half empty. And to observe your energy and the way it's impacted me has changed me. So feelings mutual, man. I love being around you.

(Joel Beasley at 00:13:21) Oh, buy the book, people. Buy the book. It's on Amazon. It's called CTO Excellence in 100 Days.

(Etienne de Bruin at 00:13:30) Yes. Becoming the Leader That Your Company Deserves.

(Joel Beasley at 00:13:34) I've got a—for those of you who aren't watching on YouTube, step one, go subscribe to YouTube. Step two, Etienne's face is on the screen behind me with the book, and it's beautiful, and it says CTO Excellence. Whoever did your cover art did it—who, let's give a shout out. Who did your cover art, man?

(Etienne de Bruin at 00:13:49) Dude, Scribe Media, man. Houndstooth Press. They are an incredible company. I do have to do a shout out to them. I'm doing my second book with them as well. They are a phenomenal company, phenomenal team. They care passionately about people like you and me getting our stories out. So Scribe Media, brilliant company. I also want to give a shout out to all the people that endorsed the book. Of course, Sri from PayPal is on there and Alex Balazs from Intuit, chief architect at Intuit. So they were all very kind to endorse the book. And, yeah, I'm hoping people will be sufficiently puzzled by the things that I think are important and equally amazed at the impact it can have on their roles.

(Joel Beasley at 00:14:42) What's the most important takeaway from the book? If I just remember one thing after walking away and reading that entire book, what would that one thing be?

(Etienne de Bruin at 00:14:50) Oh, man. I think it's in that title. It's how to become the leader your company deserves. I think we, as CTOs, technical leaders, technical, like, brilliant, logical, computational machines, I think we think that the company needs to wrap itself around how we think and how we do things. And this book really emphasizes being in service to the culture, being less than in your ego and in your leadership approach to really put others first. I'm a lover, so there's a lot of love in the book. And to really go about how we impact people, you know, below us on the org chart and above us on the org chart with love and respect.

(Joel Beasley at 00:15:41) You're the man. How's your health doing?

(Etienne de Bruin at 00:15:46) It's been, it's been so-so, man. I've been pursuing better health, lowering my mental stress. And so I've been focusing a lot on more relaxation. I realized that when I became an entrepreneur about 25 years ago—maybe we're born entrepreneurs, but when I really started earning my own income from my own efforts, I just didn't stop. I didn't stop. I lost track of weekends, seven days a week, eight to five. All of that stuff goes out the door. And, you know, I just turned 50 last year, and, man, I just realized I have to start prioritizing my energy, my health for my—my kids are preteens, and they need me, man. So I've scaled down. I exercise more. I definitely am religious about what I eat. I know you went on that kick many years ago, right? So the health thing is important.

(Joel Beasley at 00:16:59) Yes. I made a new change last week where I went full on—this is a mini. This is an iPhone mini. They don't make it anymore. They make a 13, but they don't make a 14. So this is now the personal phone. So Friday at five, work phone gets turned off. And then I have this one and only—no Slack. Because here's the thing. There, people were telling me at the store, when I was trying to buy stuff from them, they're telling me why I shouldn't. I'm like, that doesn't make sense. But they said, "You know, you can put your phone—it's got this focus mode, and it's got work mode and personal mode." I said, "I don't have the self-control to know there's several business deals pending and not open up Slack even if there's not a red bubble. It's just Saturday afternoon. I have a minute or two. Kids are doing something or whatever. I want to just take a peek at it." Or my work email—there's no work email on there either. So I got my first new personal Gmail account in 20 years.

(Etienne de Bruin at 00:18:00) You know, it's a phenomenal journey, dude. I commend you for that. I'm on that journey. I didn't connect the idea of two phones because I thought two phones was the IT guy with the SRE who was, you know, manning the phone system. But I realize now that the physical separation of the two device—like, I'm trying to manage it on this thing. It's not working. And, you know, I find my muscle memory is constantly refreshing my emails. I go and even if I delete the emails, then it's back on because I forgot that I'm driving to meet at a restaurant. The information's in an email. I think that's a great idea. I am definitely going to explore this two phones approach, work phone and private phone approach.

(Joel Beasley at 00:18:53) Can I make a suggestion? Try the mini. You can return it if you don't like it. It's beautiful.

(Etienne de Bruin at 00:19:01) Yes. And I will say, I will say that I texted you earlier this year to say, "Hey. I'm making some radical changes for my mental health." And really, when I say mental health, I mean get out of this compressor that I've been in for 25 years. And you were, like, right there with me. You're like, "Hey, man. Wow. That's amazing. I'm also doing it." You're, of course, you know, younger than I am.

(Etienne de Bruin at 00:19:26) So I love that you have this awareness and determination so early on. You know, I started getting my vitals were starting to tell me that if I don't make a change, I am gonna become a cliche, either around my mortality or around medications and chronic illness. And that gave me a very, very rude awakening. And as I started realizing that this needed to change, I took a look at my, you know, building tech for so many years and just this incredible rat race of things constantly changing and then the veracity with which things change.

(Etienne de Bruin at 00:20:15) And, you know, now we're all on dedicated servers, and now we're all moving to cloud. Now we're all moving to data science. Then we're all like, now it's all, what's AI gonna do? So a lot of it is the physical neglect, but I also realize my next layer is going to be my mindfulness to take a deep breath and to just take it easy, man.

(Joel Beasley at 00:20:46) So for you, your health, your vitals. For me, it was Tim Allen and the Santa Claus. He's that high powered exec making those toys. At the end, he's very rich and he's got his Ferrari, but he's got no family. He's working on Christmas. And I saw that one year around Christmas time, I think two or three years ago, and I just said, I don't wanna be that guy.

(Joel Beasley at 00:21:05) So I bought the camper and I decided that I have family time. I stopped working on weekends. I did the notification thing. And then now I'm trying to figure out how to take that to the next level, especially with business. I like to experiment, so I don't really care what everybody else thinks. I just experiment, and if it works for me, that's enough. I don't need it to work for you as long as it works for me. Right? I found what I'm playing with right now is I created this block in my schedule. This is a new year thing, and it's called executive function.

(Joel Beasley at 00:21:40) And it happens between, I think it's a four hour block, between like 9 a.m. and noon. And my team can book any time that they need inside of that block. And I have to solve all of my business, my operational business problems and endeavors have to happen within that block. And then the other times of the day, I can be thinking about the business or where we wanna go or calling people and, you know, loving on them or figuring out what's going on and how we can help, that type of thing, having relationships with my team members.

(Joel Beasley at 00:22:17) But that executive function block is like I just do everything in there, and then the team knows that there's these very specific, you know, block of time where they can book. So that's one of the things I'm working on.

(Etienne de Bruin at 00:22:29) Yeah. I love what you said about making sure it works for you. You know, I call it sort of my essence. What can I do from essence? Like, how can I do friendships from my essence? How can I do my calendar from my essence? How can I do my free time, my parenting from my essence? And what I'm experimenting with now is I basically do a full Monday. I do and then I do half days, Tuesdays and Wednesdays, and then I have Thursdays and Fridays completely empty. And I found that I actually cherish my mornings for what works for me is if I can have so-called rummaging around kind of mornings where I, you know, I can take the kids to school, I make breakfast, I can do some reading, I sit in the sun.

(Etienne de Bruin at 00:23:29) I just find that if I have given myself a lot of space in the mornings, then I knock out on Mondays and Tuesdays and Wednesdays. I have just a small three hour block. Like, I think that's your executive function block. And that's where I'm like, okay, I can do coaching sessions. I can do some operational things, but that is extremely time boxed limited space. And so what goes in there is also super important tasks. Like, to make it into that box, you need to be a very important thing. And that's working. It's really changing. Like, this is my first, you're my first call today, and it's been amazing. This morning, I've been by myself.

(Joel Beasley at 00:24:21) Your next book has to be called The Power of Puttering. It's puttering around.

(Etienne de Bruin at 00:24:27) Puttering around.

(Joel Beasley at 00:24:28) At the end, we did it. We made a podcast, brother. How do you feel?

(Etienne de Bruin at 00:24:32) Yeah. Good. I really appreciate you helping me with the little roadshow. And, you know, you're doing amazing work, so I'm thankful that you're helping me. Thank you.

(Joel Beasley at 00:24:46) Thank you so much for listening. And if you found this episode useful, please share it with a friend or colleague who you think would get value from it. And if you have topics that you'd like to hear discussed on the podcast, either add me on LinkedIn or send me an email [email protected]. Every time I get an email or LinkedIn message, it absolutely makes my day and inspires me to keep going.